Gospel Motivations for Forgiveness - Part 1
With the new year comes a new season of brand new episodes, and new cohosts through the season!
Forgiveness is one of the most difficult responsibilities of the Christian. When we’ve been hurt deeply, how can we show forgiveness to those who’ve wronged us?
Janet Aucoin and one of our new cohosts, Noelle Haynie, explore Christ’s example of forgiveness from the cross. They examine His intercessory work and His bearing of both the sin and pain of the world. This discussion reveals the hope we have in Christ’s work for us, and how we can extend that same hope to others who have wronged us.
Episode TranscriptResources
Podcasts/Sermons
Forgiveness - Joyful Journey Podcast
Forgiveness Sermon Series - Milton Vincent
Demonstrating Hesed Love - Joyful Journey Podcast
The Hesed Love of God - Joyful Journey Podcast
Books
Unpacking Forgiveness - Chris Brauns
Website
Jocelyn: I don't just need to feel better. I need the truth. And ultimately that will make me better.
Janet: I just want to make it as totally simple as possible for ladies to see that the Bible is really applicable to their everyday life.
Jocelyn: When they understand theology, the application flows out of it quickly with joy.
Janet: It is a journey, but even the journey itself is joyful when I'm doing it, holding the hand of my savior and trusting him all along the way. This is the joyful journey podcast, a podcast to inspire and equip women to passionately pursue beautiful biblical truth on their journey as women of God. When you choose truth, you're choosing joy.
Janet: To get us started, I'm here with one of our new co-host, Noelle Haynie. I've known Noelle for several years now, and I'm excited for you to get to know her too. Noelle, just tell us a little bit about yourself before we get started. Who are you and why are you here?
Noelle: Who am I? Well, I grew up in a missionary family. I actually grew up on the mission field in Santiago, Chile, and then we moved to Lafayette when I was a teenager. I was in the middle of my sophomore year of high school.
Janet: That is a tough time to move.
Noelle: Yeah, it was. It was hard, but then I went to college. I taught for a year of public school and I moved back to Lafayette in 2013 and started working at Faith Christian School, which is another ministry of Faith Church. And I have been working at Faith Christian School since then. So I'm now my 13th year of teaching.
Janet: And what grades? What do you teach?
Noelle: I currently teach high school Spanish. I'm licensed in both English and Spanish, so I've taught a variety of courses over the years, but I love it. I teach high school Spanish, and then I also do instructional coaching, so I really, really love my job.
Janet: oh, that's great.
Noelle: It's fantastic. So you can probably guess based off my profession that I love teenagers so much so...
Janet: Someone needs to, yeah. I mean, that's great.
Noelle: No, I love teens. I love working with teens. I love teaching. And so that also means that I'm involved with Youth Group. I've been doing Youth Group for the entire time that I've been at Faith Church among some other ministries. So I'm really excited to get involved in this ministry too. I've been listening to a Joyful journey since its inception, and I am excited to be a part of the ministry now. I will admit that I'm a little nervous about it, but I know that God can take me and my weaknesses and display Christ through those weaknesses. So thank you for welcoming me.
Janet: Amen. I'm excited that you're here and you, have been an encouragement to me in your heart for the Lord and your heart for others, so I'm glad for others to get to know you too.
Noelle: Oh, thank you.
Janet: Well, we wanted to start this season with a topic that's actually just been very helpful to me in my growth. and that is forgiveness once again. And I say forgiveness once again because we did talk about it in season two, episode 19. Jocelyn and I did that, and I just wanna stop and say today, we will be talking about what motivates us to forgive. So if you really want to dig into more detail about what forgiveness is, just stop this episode, go to the show notes, and then go back to the one that we're going to link. I highly recommend listening to that one first. One of the definitions in that initial episode we gave was simply that forgiveness is God's plan for how to deal with sin. Our sin against God and against each other. So there's obviously a lot more to it. Go back and listen. But right now we're actually gonna do a couple of episodes on why would I want to do that?
Noelle: That's a good question. Why would we?
Janet: In that previous episode, we discussed that before there's forgiveness between people, we need to, one phrase would be stand ready to forgive. Luke 23:34 says, "Jesus said to the father, father, forgive them because they don't know what they're doing." And while he was saying that he was being mocked, they were dividing his clothes and casting lots for them.
Noelle: That's crazy.
Janet: I know. I mean, just for a minute, take that in. He doesn't say, father, don't forget how they're mocking me. Judge them.
Noelle: Yeah. This is what they deserve.
Janet: Yes. Which is what we would be doing. Right?
Noelle: Yeah.
Janet: Or Father, I'm so spiritual that if they feel really bad about it, you could forgive them. And he doesn't just forgive them, but he had the power and he could have.
Noelle: Yeah.
Janet: So what does he do? While they're mocking him, he's asking the father to put them in a position where they could be forgiven. He's interceding for them while they sin against him. That is truly amazing. And I would say that's what I mean by standing ready to forgive.
Noelle: Yeah. And I think. Often when I'm hearing things about Jesus, I think about, well, of course he's God. To just pause and remind everyone, jesus is also a hundred percent man, and so yes. This is amazing. It's not just that he can do it because he's God.
Janet: Yes. It wasn't easier.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: It was just possible.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: Yeah. Yeah. So if we're going to understand that and grow in that, what do we mean by that? Well, even before someone has repented, my heart is ready to forgive. I'm not bitter. I'm not obsessed with thinking about their sin. I'm not secretly hoping for judgment. I'm not cold and withdrawing my affection from them.
Noelle: That's a lot of things, Janet.
Janet: I know. I know. It's, it's a little supernatural. And I say that because I've actually, I've battled it myself and I've talked to other people who will say this: theologically, I can't forgive until they repent. And hey, if they do, I'll be here. And everything about their demeanor is cold. It's like if you actually came to me and you felt really bad, then I would.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: But that's not what Jesus did.
Noelle: Yeah. It's not dependent on the other person.
Janet: Yeah. So the relational forgiveness, sure. That takes repentance, but that heart standing ready to forgive, is not a heart that is cold and indifferent until.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: And that's been really challenging to me. Because we know the transaction of forgiveness between people does require the sinning one to repent. But I do think it's interesting, there is a tension in the scripture and I think we need to not try to act like that's not there.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: Mark 11:25 says, " whenever you stand praying, if you have anything against anyone, forgive him. So that your father in heaven will also forgive you, your wrongdoing."
Noelle: Anything against anyone.
Janet: That's kind of everything, isn't it? And that seems to me to imply that while you're alone with God praying. And you remember a way that you've been sinned against, there's an aspect of forgiveness right then.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: You talk to God and choose to forgive in that sense. It does not mean you're reconciled to the person, but it does mean that I have chosen. And I think back to Christ on the cross, father, forgive them. That's his heart, even when they have not repented. And when I'm praying, the Lord knows whether I'm holding onto that. And that's my opportunity to acknowledge to God I choose forgiveness. So some people call that forgiving in the heart. Or a heart of forgiveness or vertical forgiveness, or as I've said, standing ready to forgive. I'm not going to debate terms on that. I just wanted to be clear with what I'm talking about. I'm not saying that Noelle, if you punch me in the nose, I can on my own, forgive you, and there's nothing you and I need to talk about.
Noelle: Sure. Yeah.
Janet: But I can forgive from the heart. I can stand ready to forgive and then because that's my heart, I go to you not going, I cannot believe you. I go to you going, I'm concerned about you.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: That you would behave in that way. It changes even how I go to you.
Noelle: Absolutely.
Janet: So that's what we're talking about today, not the process of that conversation that you have with someone that's in the other episode, and it's incredibly important. Listen to that. But this is what needs to really be going on in my heart, regardless. So I hope we can agree we need this heart.
Noelle: Yes.
Janet: And it's supernatural. So what's gonna motivate this? I mean, think about, I have maybe been sinned against very cruelly. Truly not just you didn't do something I would prefer, but really sinned against just as Jesus was on the cross. I mean, the only man who never sinned only did what was loving to the Father, and loving to others is being killed and mocked. And my heart posture is one of forgiveness. I don't know. Noelle, what do you think is our more typical heart posture at that point?
Noelle: Well, if anyone else is like me, I would say, my typical heart posture would be if I see change in them or if I see them ready to ask for forgiveness or, I don't know I feel, at least for me, a lot of times I'm black and white. Like, okay, well if they do this, then I can do this. Yes. You know, or whatever. As opposed to thinking about everything you were just saying, standing ready to forgive. So maybe if they came to me. I definitely should not have to approach them first, that's for sure.
Janet: There you go. Because I'm the one sinned against.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: Yes. So I love that. I love that. And I think that that's where a lot of us are. I'm ready to forgive, but I don't have to do it unless they feel really bad. I need to be sure they mean it. I don't need just words. Groveling probably. And a lot of time of never sinning against me at all in any way in the future, or I'll go, I bet they didn't mean that.
Noelle: Right. They better demonstrate that they actually meant it.
Janet: Yes. And I get to determine the standard of that. Yes. In whatever way. So I think that is more typical because I don't wanna be an idiot. I don't wanna be walked all over. okay, but that has nothing to do with it.
Noelle: Especially not with your heart.
Janet: Exactly. Right. And that's what we want to do. It was a few months ago, my husband and I started listening to this sermon series that was recommended to us by Milton Vincent on forgiveness, and it was incredibly impactful for us. We're gonna link those in the show notes as well. It's a 12 part series.
Noelle: And I would just like to say, Janet, you recommended this to me. When was it? Maybe two or three months ago. Something like that. And I have, I just finished listening to it last week. It was absolutely worth it. So when I've talked about it with other people, they've said 12 parts. Oh my soul, that is so many hours, and I want to tell everyone it is absolutely worth it. And I probably should start back on episode one now.
Janet: I know I'm on my third time through them. Now he is going to define what he's talking about as forgiveness. He is gonna later talk about the relational aspect of it. But what he says is forgiving is whatever phrase you wanna use, standing ready to, whatever it is. It's about the heart posture. And it was so convicting and hopeful, like all at the same time. Yes. Which I don't know how he did that, but he did. And he does that doing what he calls the first four sermons are his 360 around the cross, which you probably remember. That material was so impactful to me, way beyond forgiveness, like just thinking about on a deeper level what the cross shows me, was amazing. My husband, then we've more recently, in our adult bible fellowships, our adult Sunday school, what we call them, recently taught on forgiveness, and he had added a few additional thoughts. So I'm gonna be taking a couple of episodes to really flesh out how the gospel, a lot of it primarily from that sermon series that we highly recommend, and also from some things that my husband talked about as well, how those things about the gospel should motivate us to forgive. So, I found it helpful, compelling, challenging, but at the same time never shaming and always hopeful.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: So, I hope, I will not do it justice. I'm hoping that you listen to these two episodes and say, I'm gonna take Noelle's challenge and actually try to start listening to the sermons. You will not be sorry.
Noelle: You'll not, and honestly, I listened to most of them when I was getting ready in the morning or when I was going out for a walk or something like that. I think I would like to at some point sit down and take notes and all of that, but I just, oh man, everyone, you need to listen to them.
Janet: Well, let me at least start out for us some definitions cause that's what we do. We always make sure we're all talking about the same thing. In Chris Brauns, in his book, Unpacking Forgiveness, another excellent book defines God's forgiveness as "a commitment by the one true God to pardon, graciously those who repent and believe so that they're reconciled to him. Although this commitment does not eliminate all consequences.
Noelle: Okay.
Janet: And we talk a lot about that in our first episode. Then he goes on to define forgiveness between believers as "a commitment by the offended to pardon, graciously the repentant." So there has to be repentance for that transaction to take place between them "from the moral liability and to be reconciled to that person. Again, although not all consequences are necessarily eliminated." So, so far we're hearing about what forgiveness looks like when someone is repentant. Both mentioned that it's done graciously. Which in itself is a tall order. And the reality is I can't be sitting around harboring bitterness in my heart and be ready to respond graciously.
Noelle: Yeah.
Janet: I may respond self righteously.
Noelle: Sure.
Janet: And I'm willing to forgive you because you're lower than me. That's not graciously. Vincent then goes on and gives a definition not limited to those who are repentant. He's including the heart of forgiveness or the standing ready to forgive regardless of the other person just as we saw Jesus do on the cross. His definition is paraphrased like this. It's a choice to send away the offense between two people, releasing the offender from deserved vengeance and positively blessing the offender with undeserved favor. That's a lot of words, but does anything strike you about that, Noelle?
Noelle: Yes, and I actually remember when I was first listening to this definition, Vincent's definition, that the words send away for some reason that was helpful to me. I was closing my eyes and just thinking literally the shoving motion, sending it away. That was powerful to me to think, okay, so we talked about graciously, you know? So you're sending it away and you're not focused on what is deserved. Like I said before, I'm a little bit black and white, sometimes it's just justice or whatever. It's, no, we're not focusing on that. And not only are we not focused on it, we're also sending it away. We're sending away the offense.
Janet: Now that doesn't mean that they're right with God. But it means that when I look at them, the first thing I see is not what they've done. it's not right there between us. That was a visual. It's helpful for me too. It's like that I have given to the Lord, I've lamented it If it hurt, like I've been honest with the Lord about all of that. And then I'm able to look at them and not look at them through their sin. And then to the fact that it says positively bless the offender with undeserved favor.
Noelle: So it's a put off, put on.
Janet: Yes. That's crazy. Yes. You know, I think about Romans 2:4 that says it's God's kindness, his positively blessing us, that leads us to repentance. It isn't waiting until we repent. It's not like God's up there going, there's a lot of kindness I'll give to you if you do this. While they were mocking, he is kind. While we are mocking his ways, when I am sinning, I am mocking God's ways and he is kind.
Noelle: Right. And he's not kind because he wants you to repent. He's kind because it's who he is.
Janet: Yeah.
Noelle: So I just think about myself. I'm not going to be kind to the offender just because I want them to repent from the sin against me. You know?
Janet: Yeah. Although part of the kindness is you do want that.
Noelle: Well, of course. Yeah. But not to manipulate them.
Janet: Right. No, I hear what you're saying. But it's like, yes, God does want us to repent for our good. And you do want them to repent, and when your heart is where it ought to be, you want them to repent for their good. But it's not, I'll be kind to you, so you'll do what I want for me. Make me feel better about the terrible thing you did. Yeah. And that is amazing hesed, again, we did two, three episodes on that over time in the past. You can look those up. But that hesed, that kind of kindness, that kind of love is intended to just draw my heart to want to repent. So in some shadowy way, we get to do that. I get to make it easier for the other person to even want to honor the Lord by how much I undeservedly grace them.
Noelle: Isn't that awesome?
Janet: In theory. It's awesome.
Noelle: It's awesome if we do our part. Yeah.
Janet: It is. And it is actually very freeing. Getting there is hard and we will talk about that. So there's a lot to that whole phrase and the definition. He spends a lot of time fleshing it out over many of his sermons. But right now I just want us to focus on why would I even be willing to consider doing that. Like something in my flesh says, when you said they should come to me. I shouldn't have to go to them. And then God, this definition is saying while they're sinning, you actively bless them. Like, I shouldn't have to go first.
Noelle: Yeah.
Janet: Why would I be willing? What would motivate me? So what I'm gonna do is just begin in this episode and, finish in the next, just share some of the specific gospel truths that Vincent shared with some of my thoughts about it. and then, this is only a flyover, it's not gonna hit everything but these truths have really impacted my soul. The first one, and these actual truths are quoting him basically. He says, "Christ bore to the full extent our griefs and our sorrows, not just our sins." That's amazing. I don't know. Do you have Isaiah 53 there? Can you read verses four and five?
Noelle: Yes. Isaiah 53, starting in verse four says, "yet it was our weaknesses. He carried. It was our sorrows that weighed him down. And we thought his troubles were a punishment from God, a punishment for his own sins, but he was pierced for our rebellion, crushed for our sins. He was beaten so we could be whole. He was whipped so we could be healed."
Janet: So I have read that many times. Yeah. And reveled in the fact that he took my sin on the cross and they're all paid for Jesus bore all of my sin. Praise God, absolutely I need that, but I don't know why I had never thought about before what it says right before that. That you just read in verse four, before Isaiah tells us that great news. He says "he bore our griefs and our sorrows." And I'm like, what? He chose to feel all of my pain, not just from my sin, which my sin brings me pain. And he feels that. But from my sorrow. I don't know why and we even, there's a song and I'm not even gonna remember what it is. He took our, sin and our sorrow. He made them his very own something to Calvary, I don't know. And suffered and died alone. How marvelous, how wonderful. It's all in there. But he says, so it's in there. But I never think about it says, and my sorrow.
Noelle: Yes. I was thinking about the song Man of Sorrows. Is that connected to this?
Janet: I don't even remember all the words to it. I'd have to probably, it's not like that's a new concept. It's right there, in Isaiah 54, but I immediately jumped to he took my sin, but it is really important that I recognize that. I knew from Hebrews two that he suffered so that he could understand my pain. He tells me that in Hebrews two, he became, man, so he could suffer and understand our pains. And when I read that, I'm very grateful for it. And in my mind it meant he had suffered the same kinds of things that I had. If I've suffered betrayal, so has he. If I've suffered, people misinterpreting me, so has he. Now his is all unjust. Sometimes I suffer consequences of my own sin. He never sinned. But I thought, well, yeah, and he was certainly physically tortured in ways I can't imagine. But I have talked with precious women who have suffered in horrific ways that we are not specifically told Christ suffered. And so does he understand theirs? And we've had to kind of wrestle through that a little bit. it's even more than the fact that he understands the categories. Just as he truly was crushed because of my sin and we all know that, not just sin in general, but he was crushed because of mine specifically. It also says he felt my sorrow. So if I have felt sorrow. He felt it on the cross.
Noelle: Right. He bore it.
Janet: That's crazy. I never noticed that before. Vincent then relates how Jesus was offered a mild anesthetic on the cross. It says they gave him some sour wine and when he tasted it, he refused it. The way he says it, it's as if Jesus was saying to the father, I don't want to be numbed. I want to feel all that Janet felt. All of her pain, all of her sorrow, and all of her sin and the consequences that she deserves for it. There is nothing she will feel that I haven't already felt with her. That was really mind boggling to me. Even in the pain of being sinned against, he knows all about it. Not just because he was sinned against, though he was, but in addition, he felt all of mine. I'm not alone. Pain and suffering, and in our context, the pain of being sinned against can be so isolating. Others can't completely understand. And I've been there like when I go to explain something and the response is, well, but it wasn't that. and it's like, you don't, get how I'm feeling right now. And that's okay. Like it's not sin that they're not inside me and they can't get it, but there is one who totally understands. I have been in situations where I've had to really be careful of my speech. Because I was misrepresented. And so I'm, ultra sensitive to how I say something. 'cause I'm afraid it'll get misrepresented. And I've actually been praying and sometimes found that I'm like trying to wordsmith. And I'm, well, you know, but I do know this and I'm not trying to say, and, but what I mean, and I realize I don't have to do that. Like he knows. He knows. He knows exactly what I mean. He's not ever gonna misunderstand me. And he felt it. So when I tell him I'm really hurting, he can go, no, I actually know. That's crazy. And to think that he chose to feel it so that I wouldn't be alone. So what does that have to do with being willing to forgive? You know, Vincent makes the remark that sometimes our desire for retaliation, our bitterness, our unwillingness to forgive, is that we want someone else to hurt so that we're just less alone. You need to know how I feel. So I'm gonna give you a dose of your own medicine. And now how does that feel? You know, it's like I'm not gonna be the only one hurting here. You need to feel it too. And so then we're willing to vengeance his mine, say of Janet. So that they'll feel it too. So he says, if we neglect this truth, if I don't revel in, thank him for and live in the reality that Jesus truly knows and truly has felt it with me. I'm either gonna clamor for sympathy from others. I'm trying to find somebody that will understand. And so I talk about it all the time and maybe I even exaggerate it or whatever I have to do. And, I need you to know how bad it is and I'm gonna be frustrated because I can't find a complete understanding or I may be willing to inflict pain on somebody else. So they're miserable too. And that was really interesting to me to think about. Okay, so the times that I want vengeance and the times that I just want someone to completely understand, so I'm obsessed with talking about it. The answer to that is there is someone who completely understands. I'm not alone. How does that impact you to even think about?
Noelle: Yeah, one who completely understands everything. That's really powerful. I was thinking about when you were talking, have you ever heard that phrase "Hurt people, hurt people"?
Janet: Yes.
Noelle: And you know, that could be true, but what if we flipped it forgiven people forgive people.
Janet: Ooh. Well, and both I think are true.
Noelle: Right. And so if we think about he understands we're not alone. He felt what we felt that should be able to then motivate us. Like you were talking about it, forgiven people forgive people. And when we're not alone, it's almost empowering, you know? To know that you're not alone in what you felt. It's empowering then to choose right.
Janet: Yeah. Well, I think it makes it even more possible to choose right because now I don't have to spend my energy trying to get someone to understand.
Noelle: Right.
Janet: Like that's done. There is one. Would I like other people to understand probably. But it's like, okay, Lord, I think in pictures and I will picture where he's just holding my hand. And it's like, I know. Okay. Then that's all I need. I desire maybe, but that's all I need. Now out of gratitude for one who knows me and chose to know me to that degree, I wanna do what he wants me to do. And now there's a beginning of a motivator at least. So that's one aspect. Another aspect that Vincent draws out sometimes God purposes, that those he loves dearly be painfully sinned against.
Noelle: I do not like that.
Janet: I know that is so hard and I think it's so good to think about though because especially if I'm sinned against over and over and over, and even if it's, again, these go way beyond being sinned, against even just suffering. If it's over and over, it's easy to begin to think, does he really care about me? Does God really love me? He's letting this person sin against me. It's not like a one and done. If God loved me, why wouldn't he stop this? If I loved someone, I wouldn't allow whatever, but then we have to remember, I'm very, very thankful that he purposed that Jesus whom he loved dearly be painfully sinned against because it saved my soul. He loved his son dearly. His son never deserved any pain, and God ordained that he would suffer more than anyone else ever. And not just the unjust suffering that happened during his earthly life. And there was plenty of that, but he bore all of my suffering and pain, and he bore all of your suffering and pain. And God loves no one more than his precious son Jesus. And when I remember that, at least I can't say he must not love me if he let me suffer, right? Because I know he loves Jesus and what he did in ordaining Jesus's suffering is actually part of the proof that he loves me too. So how do you think that could encourage us to actually want to be able to forgive?
Noelle: That's a great question. I would say as I've been learning about forgiveness and thinking about justice and all of those different aspects, one of the most powerful things for me was understanding God ordaining suffering and God ordaining even or purposes, I think the statement was that he purposes for people to be sinned against. There's a whole lot that I could get into there. But one of the most encouraging passages that, I have been studying and thinking about a lot is from Psalm 1 39, which a lot of times when we hear that, we think about the fearfully and wonderfully made. Which is true and beautiful. But verse 16 says, you saw me before I was born. Every day of my life was recorded in your book. And then this last phrase here, every moment was laid out before a single day had passed. So every moment, I just think about that all the time, every moment. How can that be possible? I mean, you hear it all the time. How could a good God allow evil? But it's more personal when you're saying, Hey, I'm going through this suffering, in this case, being sinned against, God ordains that. Well, we could talk about that in a lot of different passages throughout scripture, but
Janet: But it's there.
Noelle: Personal, personal every day of my life. Every day of Noel's life was planned before I was born, and so that, oh my goodness, that's so motivational in helping me to think about being able to forgive because it means that none of this surprised God, Janet. None of it.
Janet: Right. None of it's outside his plan. You're not primarily the victim of someone who has sinned against you, though you may be that but you're primarily. The daughter of the king of the universe who decided that this is what was best for you to show what he's like. Like there is a, something way bigger, because that's what Jesus did. It amazes me that over and over in scripture, he talks about his hour of glorification and it's the cross. Like my hour has come. If you would say to me, what's the hour that's gonna show me God's glory. I wouldn't have said horrific suffering. But the fact that he would do that showed his love. And that is his glory. And then to think, okay, the God who loves me like that has said there's a purpose for this. It doesn't make it not hurt. But it does mean, I can trust this God, if he had good purposes in what he allowed in Jesus, he does for me too. And that allows me to be motivated to, it's not primarily about me and that other person. It's primarily about me and the Lord. Yeah, here's a third one. God the Father can be completely trusted on the receiving end of any wrongdoing. And that's an interesting phrase, but when I'm on the receiving end, in that moment when someone is evilly sinning against me, I can completely trust the father. How does the gospel show me that? Well, Vincent repeated the phrase frequently, that the cross isn't just a man dying, but a man trusting. And to your point, Noelle, he is God, but he was a hundred percent man. Like this is a man on the cross trusting his father. That's who he is. First Peter 2: 23 says that on the cross, Jesus entrusted himself to the father. And how did that play out for him? It wasn't because I trusted the father, the bad didn't happen. You know, John 6:38, Jesus says, "for I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me." I can't say that that's how I've lived a hundred percent at all, but Jesus did. He trusted and obeyed his father from start to finish. So what was his life? He condescends to come as a baby, and instead of being thanked, his mother is mocked, and later on he's ridiculed for being born out of wedlock. And in their society that was very shameful. In John 8:41, they say, we weren't born of sexual immorality. We have one father God. So he is mocked for the virgin birth. And he kept trusting his father. He's told that his ability to free those demon possessed is because he's from Satan, which I can't even imagine looking at Jesus and saying, well, it's because you're of Satan. And all that he could have done in that moment. And he trusted his father. He's betrayed by his close companion, Judas, and he's denied by Peter. And then he is arrested all while he's essentially saying, I trust you, father. Not my will, but yours.
Noelle: Yeah. I was just reading the passage where Judas portrayed Jesus this morning. And I was thinking about, you know how sometimes we say, well, you know, we were just talking about this. Well, he's God, so it's okay. No, imagine knowing that someone was gonna betray you and how much time and effort and love and service had he already put into Judas knowing the entire time that Judas was gonna betray him. I feel like that's almost harder. It was harder that he was,
Janet: Oh, it had to be. Because he didn't withdraw his affection to protect himself from the later pain, which is what I would wanna do.
Noelle: Absolutely. If you told me that someone was gonna hurt me, I would just not be close to them in the first place.
Janet: Right. No.
Noelle: And he chose to trust his father.
Janet: The whole time. He's falsely accused. He's blindfolded, he spit on, I trust you, father. Punch after punch, and between each one, I trust you father. Crowds irrationally howling against him before Pilate. He keeps trusting, condemned to die, still trusting. If this was a movie, we're like, he's gonna get saved at the last minute. Because if it's right, that's what has to happen. He's gotta get delivered. No, he's whipped, he's scorched. He's a crown of thorns beaten into him. Father, I trust you. Nails driven into his body. I trust you. Writhing naked on a cross. He trusts his father, even turns his back on him and he experiences rejection, but in trust, he says, father, into your hands, I commit my spirit. He trusted all the way to the end. I mean, have you ever been in a season Noelle, where you're seeking to trust and it just keeps getting worse and worse?
Noelle: Yeah. I was just talking with a friend the other day about this, like, I feel like if I am doing the right thing. Then the equation is that then hardships will stop.
Janet: Yes, yes. What am I doing wrong? That they've continued.
Noelle: Right. And my friend who is very wise, actually used this exact phrase and she said to me, all of these things that you're going through, you know, there's this hard thing and this hard thing and this hard thing. We listed these different things. Jesus looks at you and she used the word whisper, which I love, and Jesus whispers to you, you can trust my father and I don't know. Something about that physical picture in my head, you know, of Jesus holding my face in his hands and whispering, you can trust my father. And it comes from someone who has done it. He has done it. And he's gone through obviously way worse experiences than what I've gone through. So, I mean, I would say, yeah, I've been through a season where things just keep on getting worse, but then to think, okay, and I can still trust.
Janet: Yes. Just like he did. and we can look at the end and go, okay, did the father come through? Was it worth it to Jesus? Was Jesus shown wise to trust his father who orchestrated that it would get worse and worse and worse and worse and worse all the way to a horrific death. He was raised from the dead.
Noelle: Yeah.
Janet: I mean, he was vindicated by the father raising him from the dead. And now the Bible says that he gave Jesus the highest position of honor. So Jesus can confidently look at you and go, I know. I do understand. And you can trust my father. And I am living proof that you can trust my father. And I love that because the temptation is to turn from the father when things are hard like that. Or when they're unfair instead of realizing. We can trust the father too.
Noelle: Yeah, and I don't know if you did this intent intentionally, Janet, but you said, I am living proof. Jesus says I am living proof. I mean, he was literally resurrected. I'm living proof. That's amazing because I was thinking about how we are not promised even to understand the suffering or the injustice in this world. Right now, right. We might get to, I can definitely look back at times in the past where I've been wronged and where I've suffered, where then later on I get to see the results of that or God's kindness through it. We don't know if that's gonna happen every time, though. But we do have Christ's example living proof in your words. And we do know that if we have a relationship with him, we know who wins the battle. So we do have proof. We do know that our heart posture here and now matters regardless if we get to see the end result.
Janet: Yes.
Noelle: Living proof. I like that.
Janet: Well, there is so much more we can glean by focusing on the gospel, but I hope you're seeing how this can begin to motivate us to be able to even want to forgive. We're gonna stop on the examples here, and in the next episode we're gonna pick up. So if you're going, is there more? There's a lot more, but we're gonna divide it for you in the next episode let's look at several other aspects of the gospel. Thank you, Noelle, for this discussion today.
Noelle: Absolutely.
To keep from missing any future episodes, please sign up for our newsletter on our webpage faithlafayette.org/JJP From there you can also subscribe to this podcast on Apple, Google, or Spotify. You can also visit us on our Facebook page or Instagram at Joyful Journey Podcast. If you have questions or comments for us, you can email us at joyfuljourneyquestions@outlook.com. Joyful Journey Podcast is a ministry of Faith Bible Seminary. All proceeds go to offset costs of this podcast and toward scholarships for women to receive their MABC through Faith Bible Seminary.
Host Janet and her husband, Brent, also speak at a variety of conferences as a way to raise money for the seminary. If you want to look at what they offer or book them for a conference, go to their website.
